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Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

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Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

Matthew Talbert
See request at http://www.crosswire.org/forums/mvnforum/viewthread_thread,979

I thought it might be of interest after our recent discussions about
reference parsing.

Matthew

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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

DM Smith-5
I don't think that this would be too hard to implement in the SWORD engine. The trick would be to note the difference between user supplied punctuation and that coming from modules. And generated references could use them too. This is similar to the standard internationalization of decimal numbers. Essentially it could be driven by a small array of separators.

In Him,
        DM

On Nov 1, 2010, at 6:40 PM, Matthew Talbert wrote:

> See request at http://www.crosswire.org/forums/mvnforum/viewthread_thread,979
>
> I thought it might be of interest after our recent discussions about
> reference parsing.
>
> Matthew
>
> _______________________________________________
> sword-devel mailing list: [hidden email]
> http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel
> Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page


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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

Jonathan Morgan
Are you suggesting that we support making the choice of reference system an option (e.g. by default we support "Genesis 3:12, 15, 19", but you can configure it so that it supports "Genesis 3, 12. 15. 19"), or that we try to make the parser handle both reference systems simultaneously?  The latter could be tricky, and I don't think that every reference would be unambiguous (for example, in a ThML module "Genesis 3,4" might be a valid reference for "Genesis 3 - 4" in a daily reading planner, but Genesis 3:4 in the other reference system.  I couldn't see any reading planners encoded like that though).

Jon

On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 1:26 PM, DM Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
I don't think that this would be too hard to implement in the SWORD engine. The trick would be to note the difference between user supplied punctuation and that coming from modules. And generated references could use them too. This is similar to the standard internationalization of decimal numbers. Essentially it could be driven by a small array of separators.

In Him,
       DM

On Nov 1, 2010, at 6:40 PM, Matthew Talbert wrote:

> See request at http://www.crosswire.org/forums/mvnforum/viewthread_thread,979
>
> I thought it might be of interest after our recent discussions about
> reference parsing.
>
> Matthew
>
> _______________________________________________
> sword-devel mailing list: [hidden email]
> http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel
> Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page


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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

David Haslam
How many different standards for Biblical passages reference format are there?
Where are they each documented?

I read several months ago of someone who had to laboriously go through a paper he'd submitted to a journal and edit every reference he'd used merely in order to conform to the editing policy requirements of the journal.

David
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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

Matthew Talbert
On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 3:55 AM, David Haslam <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> How many different standards for Biblical passages reference format are
> there?

I think the real issue here is that many cultures use different
symbols for separation than we do in English (or I should say, the
US). I believe it is common in Europe to use , as the decimal
separator and . as the thousands which is exactly opposite from here.
So, the real issue is being able to parse input in the locale of the
user rather than any standard for Biblical passages.

Matthew

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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

David Haslam
Parsing user input for references in other locales is one thing, but would we wish to suggest that front-ends
should also output and/or display Biblical references according to [something related to] the locale?

I'm thinking of the whole gamut of front-ends, from diatheke to Xiphos.

I've never tried using the [-l locale] argument in diatheke, so I don't know how this affects the output.
cf.  Valid locale values depend on installed locales. en is default.

For all I know, the SWORD API may already do something like this. Please educate me further.

David
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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

DM Smith-5
In reply to this post by Jonathan Morgan
Jon,
I mean that for any given reference, it is parsed by one notation or the other, not both. If the input is provided by an end user via the keyboard, it would use the user's stated preference. When formatting references for output, it would also be used. But for all references coming from a module, it would use the current notation. Of course, we could have a conf entry in a module that would provide the punctuation. But I don't think that is necessary, as in OSIS there is a fixed notation using periods and ThML can use OSIS refs.

That way it is unambiguous.

In His Service,
DM

On Nov 2, 2010, at 2:54 AM, Jonathan Morgan wrote:

Are you suggesting that we support making the choice of reference system an option (e.g. by default we support "Genesis 3:12, 15, 19", but you can configure it so that it supports "Genesis 3, 12. 15. 19"), or that we try to make the parser handle both reference systems simultaneously?  The latter could be tricky, and I don't think that every reference would be unambiguous (for example, in a ThML module "Genesis 3,4" might be a valid reference for "Genesis 3 - 4" in a daily reading planner, but Genesis 3:4 in the other reference system.  I couldn't see any reading planners encoded like that though).

Jon

On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 1:26 PM, DM Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
I don't think that this would be too hard to implement in the SWORD engine. The trick would be to note the difference between user supplied punctuation and that coming from modules. And generated references could use them too. This is similar to the standard internationalization of decimal numbers. Essentially it could be driven by a small array of separators.

In Him,
       DM

On Nov 1, 2010, at 6:40 PM, Matthew Talbert wrote:

> See request at http://www.crosswire.org/forums/mvnforum/viewthread_thread,979
>
> I thought it might be of interest after our recent discussions about
> reference parsing.
>
> Matthew

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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

Peter Von Kaehne
In reply to this post by David Haslam
On 02/11/10 07:55, David Haslam wrote:
> I read several months ago of someone who had to laboriously go through a
> paper he'd submitted to a journal and edit every reference he'd used merely
> in order to conform to the editing policy requirements of the journal.

Sed or Perl with a regex would have sorted that. ;-)

Peter

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Re: Support more alternative verse syntaxes, e.g. "Luke 13, 12"

David Haslam
Peter,

Agreed, yet how many pastors, theology students or Biblical scholars even know about regexp?

And if the submitted paper had been edited in [say] MS Word, the author would first have to copy the content to a file format that was capable of being processed by sed, Perl or similar. And then paste it all back again, without loss of overall formatting.

Of course, if they had a copy of DataMystic WordPipe, it would be a cinch too, but that ain't free, beyond the evaluation download.

David
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